Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)



  • 1. How many sentences in 00_18 section of WSJ tagged corpus?
    Hello, I recently extracted the pos tagged sentences from Penn treebank (tagged/pos/wsj directory). I assume sentences in wsj_XXXX.pos files are separated by either blank lines or a line of ==============. So I find there are total 51681 sentences in 00 - 18 section, which is different from the number reported in some papers (around 38000 sents). Here's a list of numbers of sentences per section I got: 2454 wsj_00.text 2522 wsj_01.text 2506 wsj_02.text 2508 wsj_03.text 2872 wsj_04.text 2743 wsj_05.text 2313 wsj_06.text 2801 wsj_07.text 2877 wsj_08.text 2676 wsj_09.text 2480 wsj_10.text 2841 wsj_11.text 2691 wsj_12.text 3191 wsj_13.text 2795 wsj_14.text 2787 wsj_15.text 3575 wsj_16.text 2247 wsj_17.text 2802 wsj_18.text 2311 wsj_19.text 2529 wsj_20.text 3023 wsj_21.text 3209 wsj_22.text 3041 wsj_23.text 2796 wsj_24.text 68590 total Any tips? Best, Zhang Le
  • 2. natural language newbie
    Hello! I'm a computer science student...have done some programming (including a chess engine), and am fascinated by AI. My personal dream is to have Commander Data's walking around the earth by the time I die :). Anyway, was wondering if someone could help me out by pointing me in the right direction online for learning some of the basics of NLP. I'd like to write my own program which could take an article/story and be able to answer questions about it. E.g., If I had a text file that told the story of Jack and the bean stalk, I want the program to be able to answer questions like "what did Jack plant in the ground?", etc. Just looking for a basic introduction that will get me moving in the right direction. Thanks for any assistance. Andrew
  • 3. Single Word Spoken English Sound Files
    Hi, I'm working on speech synthesis research and am in need of a spoken english corpus in the form of single word sound files (such as word1.wav, word2.wav, etc). I've found quite a few sites that have full sentences to download, and others that are very expensive! Any links? Thanks! Jonathan

Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Tue, 11 Oct 2005 21:16:29 GMT

Hi folks, (Perhaps this issue is topical here? )
t3d is almost C, but with an insertion of logical & natural language
and the C's missing stuff.

t3d's insertion to C part:
- easy to learn (2 page documentation; learns user to use an
unlimited number of std conforming t3d functions)
- enables programming to be based on any of the worlds written
- easy enough to allow limited end-user (at least script) programing
- contains a borrowed GUI, garbage collection and networking , string
boundaries etc.
- may be the most powerful programming language.
- suitable for applications, shell scripting and web-programming
- language donated to charity orgs
http://www.tele3d.com/ChOS/charity-orgs.htm with a special license
ChOS (Charity open source) http://www.t3d.org/ChOS/ChOS_beta1.zip

Ok, this presentation will attract "no it can not be done" replies,
thus we ask comments only from those, who care to read that 2 pages
worth of t3d documentation first.

Additional how to info about t3d in


Some (of about a zillion std. conforming) t3d functions are presented
on http://www.tele3d.com/t3d/functions.htm

In order to test the t3d's expressivenes, send us useful computer
tasks and we try to tell you how that task can be done using t3d.

If someone is interested our existing SVN sources are at
developer discussion forum:

Juuso Hukkanen and Markku Sukanen

(to reply by e-mail set addresses month and year to correct)
"t3d programming language" and the structure of t3d function prototype
are trademarks of Juuso Hukkanen.

ps1. For those without a web browser, below are some discussion

/******** begin t3d example 1*******************/

#include <stdio.h>
int main(void)
printf("hello world");
/******** end of t3d example 1*******************/

/********* begin t3d example 2*******************/

#include <stdio.h>
int main(void)
printf("hello world\n");
t3d_write_2SPEAKERS("Hello world");
/******** end of t3d example 2*******************/

/********* begin t3d example 3*******************/

#include <stdio.h>
int main(void)
printf("hello world");
/******** end of t3d example 3*******************/

Natural language:
the Swedes might call the last examples function through (an


the finns might call the last example function through an

or alternatively
or alternatively
t3d_kirjoita_urli_OTSIKOT_n_2KAIJUTTIMIIN /* <- common typo */


Logical language:
t3d language is expressive enough to enable building tools for itself.

in the previous example the news header playing function can be build
a following set 'standard' t3d functions / tools. note no error

* user is not required to insert
* headers pre-pre-procesor fixes
* them anyway ready befere GCC

int main(void)
unsigned char *text1 = NULL; /* unnecessary initialization

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby David Hopwood » Wed, 12 Oct 2005 00:23:42 GMT

It is difficult enough to achieve any significant adoption of a programming
language without putting arbitrary restrictions on its use.

Function prototypes cannot be trademarked.

David Hopwood < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Wed, 12 Oct 2005 02:00:58 GMT

n Mon, 10 Oct 2005 15:23:42 GMT, David Hopwood
< XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote:

<OT, but its good to make that point clear>

That is very true, there are thousands of languages. Thus to break
through a language must really have some something special. Well I
believe, and If you did read to two page documentation you should also
have noticed that it works and allows powerful functions and
application to be build. In order to be able to collect a considerable
community code collection, codes must be under some kind of shared
usage promoting license (e.g. PHP- it has such). I could have used
GPL, or on of many other licenses , but what are those actually good
for. I made a proof of concept donation to charity orgs in for of that
license, maybe they like the license or maybe it motivates them to
write a similar.
The only instance which is more hindering than GPL is the
requirement for rich country companies to make donations to their
favorite charity organization - Those companies would not start to
code material to t3d so the community loses no productivity.

Function prototype can not be patented, but a function prototype with
"distinctive character" sure can be trademarked:

"Conventionally, a trademark comprises a name, word, phrase, logo,
symbol, design, image, or a combination of one or more of these
elements. There is also a range of non-conventional trademarks which
do not fall into these standard categories."

Examples show that almost anything with "distinctive character" can be
trademarked e.g. a camel's figure in combination with a world "Perl"
is a trademark with a usage restrictions:

My trademarks have "distinctive character", are cleary identifiable,
exatly defined and constant character, thus trademarkable

The structure of t3d function prototype



I recognize those from the distance of a moon.

Besides, I practically donate both those trademarks to charity
organizations in that Charity Open Source license (Section 1.33.)

"Grantors Council is also (hereby) given a permanent and irrevocable
right to make an Ownership Claim (or otherwise request and
automatically get the full ownership rights) for both trademarks: 't3d
Programming Language' and 'the structure of t3d function prototype',
similarly as to any typical piece of Covered Material. "

The thing which I am required to do is to fight and to try to prevent
"trademark dilution". Linus Tornwalds did that a month ago by sending
some letters requesting a small amount of money from a a few companies
for the right to use linux(TM)

I have never liked seeing that "t3d programming language is a
trademark of Juuso Hukkanen" -thing, I find that embarrassing. But the
reason is a must. Similarly Sun must year after year say JavaTM.
Reason: If something is not own, it can not be donated to charities.
So basically resisting my trademarks you'd be resisting my right you'd
be resisting the rights of Red Cross and other to collect donations

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Claudio Grondi » Thu, 13 Oct 2005 18:51:17 GMT

mm... t3d ... Interesting concept and a nice experiment, so I am eager to
see how it will develop over time, but it seems, that at least I myself feel
not attracted by the way it is announced and I see so many obstacles on the
way to make it really useful, that I doubt it has a chance to achieve any
breaktroughs soon.

I am using already more or less the same concept in writing my source code
for many years as probably some other programmers also do. It seems to be
similar to the concept behind "Pythonic way of doing things", so I see t3d
more as a kind of macro-language add-on as a programming language on its
own. Why not designing it that way making it more or less programming
language independent by providing a solid concept of a t3d()
function/class/object like:
t3d("t3dfunctionCallText", arrayWithInputValues, arrayWithOutputValues)
where the idea behind it is to have a nice parser able to map a natural
language t3dfunctionCallText to existing methods of the programming
language(s) it is built upon?

What is the real actual motivation behind the project?


"Juuso Hukkanen" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news: XXXX@XXXXX.COM ...

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Jerzy Karczmarczuk » Thu, 13 Oct 2005 19:06:53 GMT

I have to say that all these discussion concerning patents,
trademarks, charity organisations, etc., are for me rather

I would like to know on what basis somebody who decided to base
na programming language on "C" can claim that this t3d may be
the "most powerful language" among all we know...
Hard to believe. Where is this power?

BTW. I would be careful about the abbreviation/suffix X3D. It exists
already and is used elsewhere (VRML ->).

Jerzy Karczmarczuk

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 00:06:48 GMT

n Wed, 12 Oct 2005 12:06:53 +0200, Jerzy Karczmarczuk
< XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote:

THANK YOU VERY MUCH SIR. I already got doubts on whether these forums
were alias-names to #misc.int-property.

short answer:

long answer:
SIR, for you I list the advantages and happily show to You how those
advantages are achieved.

How about a noll hypothesis:
"t3d is the easiest to learn and most
powerful programming language yet".
Please (Sir and anyone) keep asking questions until You know that the
null hypothesis is wrong (or right). i.e challenge me to show by how
one / few t3d function calls can logically cause the desired action.

Below initial claims for support to given null hypothesis

Claim 1: Documentation required for formulating t3d function
prototypes fits into 2 pages (Anyone can learn the t3d function
prototype between 30 minutes and few hours).

Claim 2: Expressiveness which the t3d function prototype allows is
very high - approaching the expressiveness of the natural language

Claim 3: t3d function prototypes are logical constructs which can be
given a name which others can easily guess with help of common logic,
few alias names and some intellisensing IDE

Claim 4: t3d function prototypes can be based on any of the world's
written language

Claim 5: particular t3d function prototypes can maintain the same
logical meaning when converted to other languages; allowing machine
aided translation of certain parts of code between various languages

Claim 6: Using the t3d function prototype, coder has a power to able
to correctly use tens of thousands of functions - even if the coder
had not have a prior contact to those function

t3d function naming in nutshell:

Sir, think what you want to do - formulate an easy sentence about it
e.g. I like to "(main-verb)aaa the (datatype) bbb and I'd like to have
the result written in to (object)Rccc, in addition I want the aaa to
be performed (adverb1)THIS_WAY1 and (adverb2)THIS_WAY2

For example if you want to add a number 5 to the end of a file, your
sentence would be

I would like to "add_int_Rfile_APPEND"
I would like to "add_int_Rfile_2END"
I would like to "write_int_Rfile_ADD"
I would like to "write_int_Rfile_APPEND"
I would like to "write_int_Rfile_2END"

The only missing is the lang sign t3d e.g. prototype.

int64 t3d_add_int_Rfile_APPEND(int num);
The ONLY t3d main-verbs (in English) are:
add, ai, calculate, close, convert, create, crypto, environment, find,
measure, move, open, read, remove and write

The ONLY t3d datatypes are:

For example for changing a screen resolution, You will likely first
measure current screen resolution using

int64t3d_measure_Rint_SCREEN_RESOLUTION_n_VERTICAL( int
int 64 t3d_measure_Rint_SCREEN_

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:07:26 GMT

n 12 Oct 2005 02:46:36 -0700, "Cruise Director"
< XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote:

<OFF topic, but good text - please ask / comment the t3d>

You wrote well and are chasing the right answer. t3d trademarking is
not for protecting my personal interests, if that had been the case I
could have done it multiple ways; of which the easiest had been GPL
with a semi crook dual license. The only objective with trademarking
is for being able to donate a programming language to charity
http://www.tele3d.com/ChOS/charity-orgs.htm so that all the t3d code
forms a uniform collection of code and software which users can use on
any environment. Thus trademarking is in high degree protecting the
consumer interests. Any coder who will find a piece of t3d code,
instantly knows / sees that he /she can use (and modify) the code
under the (charity organization promoting) terms in his/ her software.
If the t3d function prototype would not be trademarked, there would
create a situation of other code under various licenses would start to
contaminate the t3d code genome. Any standard peace of t3d code
(genes) is to be always under evolutive open source review, thus the
coder can expect any piece of code made using t3d programming language
to be examined and of good quality.
A consumer / end user would also know that any a program which is
(a) licensed using ChOS license and (b) stating to contain parts made
using t3d is made of good quality part. Thus the trademarking is
protecting both coder and consumer interests.

The only ones able to financially benefit from the trademarks are
those charity organizations. If I could have made the trademarking
directly for them I would have done that. It would be much more
respectable to have code saying trademark owner to be the "Red Cross"
or "Greenpeace".

So, I give the community and the charity organizations a chance to
think on whether they want a GPL- kind of license, with a special
condition that companies in rich countries need to buy a license /
donate to their favorite Charity organization.

If there is no support for the plan, I lose nothing, but at least I
tried. If I had given the t3d to public domain the end result would be
the same, except the charity orgs did not get anything.

I have quite lot of personal experience about patenting and patenting
even software. I no longer support the idea of patenting software. Or
the patenting time should be max 5 years. Why because it is much too
easy to make software patents - and the society gains nothing for
granting such patens. A few months ago I did actually campaign very
actively against allowing the software patenting within the EU;
sending e-mails to MEPS about better alternative clauses within the
law and what it could cause etc. After the patent laws were left
unchanged, some MEPS even congratulated me of successful lobbying. So,
I guess now self patenting something would not the right thing to do
So some patents are bad - some may be good, I would be support much
changes to patenting process e.g. duration 5-30 years depending on
field of technology.

</OFF topic, but good text - please comment the t3d>

Lawyers, for those I wish that there one day will be a t3d fuction:

Juuso Hukkanen
(to reply by e-mail set addresses month and year to correct)
"t3d programming language" and the structure of t3d functio

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Lauri Alanko » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 01:16:15 GMT

In article < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >,

No. But it would be on alt.usenet.kooks. Try your luck there. Cheers!

(To everyone else I suggest that they first read
and the accompanying thread before appraising the merits of prolonging
this thread any further.)


Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:02:18 GMT

n Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:51:17 -0000, "Claudio Grondi"
< XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote:

THANK YOU for eveluating the language itself ! You are right, the
future is uncertain. We now try to organize and concentrate energy for
a real breakthrough. This is a competed field, so the product must be
I think any potential success requires centralized review and
distribution of t3d code. So that everyone get everyones t3d tools;
"one writes once" principle. No one is _allowed_ to re-invent a wheel
- improvement is of cause fine.

Originally it was not intended to become a programming language - more
like library of all tools. It maybe is a C dialect since C99
conforming compiler (if any) should be able to compile the code -
should by pass all non - C99 parts = lot!.

Even if lots of pure t3d functions code can be directly inserted into
C programs. t3d with it's slightly different and additional datatypes,
is a bit too far from C to be anymore accepted.

From wikipedia:
Each programming language can be thought of as a set of formal
specifications concerning syntax, vocabulary, and meaning.

These specifications usually include:

* Data Types
* Data Structures
* Instruction and Control Flow
* Design Philosophy
* Compiler and Interpreter

well, t3d has own definition of datatypes, own set of datastructures
(barryas tables&error codes), return values must follow a clear
pattern, designed for ultilingual easiness & power, uses its own
pre-pre-processor and post-procesor during compile process

That is a good idea, but I am not certain about whether it would cause
confusion or goal disorientation. After all the project targets into
maximally easy piece by piece building of programming tools; C is easy

Your example made me thing that natural language researchers or
interpreter software writers might gain something interesting from
trying to build framework senteces consisting lets say 30 verbs, 30
objects and a few hundred dual part adverbs. If a local language
sentence could be put into that framework sentece and translated as
such. Could the receiving party language be able to formulate a
sentence with a corect meaning (based on a pre translated example

Desire to donate a programming language to charities, for it I had to
make a special license. While building the license I got an idea of
tryint to stretch the potential of a language maximally. ChOS License
is much like GPL, but countries in rich countries need to donate to
Charity organizations. There is a small but significant chance for
success.and if the ChOS license succeeds it would start to do finance
the actions of charity orgs.

Now that you know the goal and the potential of t3d, could you be
interested in joining the project?

Juuso Hukkanen
(to reply by e-mail set addresses month and year to correct)
"t3d programming language" and the structure of t3d function prototype
are trademarks of Juuso Hukkanen. Fair use is allowed within all
material which is licensed under the Charity Open Source license
(version 2005 or later). http://www.tele3d.com

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Juuso Hukkanen » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 02:50:38 GMT

How strange all these three GN:s have have multiple discussions about
natural language programming and about end user programming. Well we
want to discuss ask about a new solution kind of such solution with
unknown value (if any). 

Why? I asked hackers if they see any value with t3d;  because Google
claimed expert hackers to be able to say if it is good or not. Someone
there guessed that I self am not a master programmier, so what - I am
not. But for example Markku Sukanen the co-author for existing t3d
sources is an expert. Go and read the sources troll 

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Jan 'jast' Krueger » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 04:07:50 GMT


If that is supposed to give me the sources, they should be rewritten; the
string "svn: Can't connect to host 'messiah.ath.cx': Connection timed out"
does not translate into a sensible program, no matter which compiler I use.

As it is, the t3d toolkit does not exist anywhere; neither does any
technical documentation. The only thing that can be found is a repeated
assertion of how great the naming scheme of t3d is (though I fail to see any
closer connection to natural language in those names than in libc names).
Specifically, it appears to be impossible to supply t3d "functions" with C
callback functions, and existing articles about t3d seem to conveniently
bypass topics like concurrent programming, event-based processing, efficient
data structures etc. Basically, t3d allows for nothing but a series of black
boxes strung together, and that isn't something particularly powerful. For
example, tell me how a (compression algorithm|HTML renderer|spreadsheet
application|database server) could be implemented in t3d without having to
use a pre-written (compression algorithm|HTML rendering|spreadsheet
application|database server) module or resort to plain C code. Of course,
given the readily implemented function
t3d_spawn_miraculously_fast_database_server(), a database server is fairly
easy to write, but I doubt the t3d library will ever contain every possible

On a side note, t3d has nothing to do with functional programming (which is
a programming paradigm, not a general positive attribute in programming or
something like that, so there's no reason this discussion needs to continue
in comp.lang.functional (and I really don't want to start a discussion about
its placement in the other groups).

I'm eagerly awaiting your meaningless follow-up.

Best regards
Jan Krueger

PS. sorry for feeding. I'll plead "reference post for inevitable rehash
threads". I promise not to follow-up again until all points addressed above
are cleared up.

Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Joachim Durchholz » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 04:54:34 GMT

Juuso Hukkanen schrieb:

Ah, now I think it's getting clearer. At least a little :-)

Questions that spring to mind:
1) What data types does the language cover? Integers and files I gather 
from the examples - reals? booleans? collection types? strings?
[S{*filter*}that question - it's answered further down in your post.]
2) Is it possible to create one's own data types?
3) If the answer to (2) is "yes": how does the system know how to handle 
the new type in all the various contexts? Or is the programmer supposed 
to write code to handle all situations?
4) I might have different variations to write a new data type to a file. 
Say, one version that writes a human-readable form, one that does it in 
binary. A third for debugging purposes (e.g. to spit out strictly 
internal information that's of no interest to an application programmer, 
but something is going wrong and the author wants to look at the 
innards). How would one write all these variations, and how would an 
application programmer specify what variation is the one he wants?

Note I'm just beginning with questions - the above list are the ones 
that were triggered by the examples, I have many, many more in stock :-)

Oh, and let me be frank about my current perspective: What I currently 
understand about your approach is that it offers solutions to non-problems.
I might be wrong with that. That's why I'm asking.
Just to give you a fair ahead warning :-)


Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Matthias Blume » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 05:05:09 GMT

Joachim Durchholz < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > writes:


It offers non-solution to non-problems.

(In other words, it is complete and utter garbage.  Please, kindly end
this discussion or take it elsewhere.  Thanks.)


Re: Logical, natural language based programming language (t3d)

Postby Joachim Durchholz » Fri, 14 Oct 2005 05:09:48 GMT

Juuso Hukkanen schrieb:

Agreeing on: GUI, GC, bounds-checked strings.

Disagreeing (adequately covered in libraries) on: networking, database 
connectivity, debug mode, advanced algorithms, most advanced datatypes 
(bignum, URL, high-resolution time).

Unsure about: computers peripheral component (not sure what you mean here).

Agreeing but adequately covered in other languages (why not start with 
these and adding what's missing in them, instead of creating yet another 
niche language?): advanced types (SQL-like table).

Missing in your list of inadequacies: arithmetic overflow checking (if 
only optional), closures.

These have probably already gone towards C++ or Java.

Yes, but the value of these snippets is probably overrated. Most won't 
work in the new environment. (C++ is a good example. There has been 
little source code reuse when people transited from C to C++. Being able 
to *call* C from C++ was far more important, and is still important today.)

Er... negative values may be perfectly valid. It may be a measurement in 
degree centigrade, it may be the result of subtraction, it may be 
seconds until ETA (with positive values referring to times after ETA).

That's just the normal behavior of C.
Besides, there should really be a Boolean type. (That's such a trivial 
addition that I omitted it in the list of C's omissions above.)


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2.is class-based language models the same as cache-based language models

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at least a special case of the cahce-based language model.

3.Is sign language natural language?

Could I say this statement?
"Sign language is natual language."

Or natural language is only defined for spoken or written?

4.Natural language processing based book search

5.Cypher - Natural Language to RDF/SeRQL for the Semantic Web

6. Natural Language --> Integer Value

7. Cypher - Natural Language to RDF/SeRQL for the Semantic Web

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